Newsgroups: sci.aeronautics.airliners Path: news From: Hayes_Press@qmgate.larc.nasa.gov (Hayes N. Press) Subject: Re: Aha! The three-man 767 rears its ugly head... X-Submission-Date: 22 Dec 1992 13:25:26 GMT References: Message-ID: Approved: kls@royko.Chicago.COM Reply-To: Hayes_Press@qmgate.larc.nasa.gov (Hayes N. Press) Organization: Lockheed Engineering and Sciences Company X-Submission-Message-Id: <1h7507INNo79@rave.larc.nasa.gov> Sender: kls@royko.Chicago.COM Date: 26 Dec 92 00:01:47 CST >I knew I wasn't going mad... In a recent post, I commented on a three-man >767. Karl hadn't heard of it, which surprised me, so I went looking for >it--and couldn't find it--which surprised me even more. I finally ran across >this blurb. >I have no recollection of a picture of one of these critters, though. Can >someone clear up this matter? I don't know if I can clear this up but I can assure you that you are not going mad, unless madness is common in aerospace professionals. The original design for the 767 was indeed for a 3 person-crew (even though the anthropometrics were probably 3 man-crew biased). There was an extensive article done in Harvard Business Review (sorry I don't recall the year but it is pre-1990) on the design/production aspects. The article dealt with the management approaches used to determine whether the production line of the first 30 or so, 767 should be stopped and retrofited "in-position" or whether the line should be allowed to continue with the first ~30 being 3 person-crew and the ~31st and then on being the two person variety. In summary, the decision was to build the first ~30 as 3 person-crew and then if (when) they got certification of a two person configuration they would tear-out the third station and make the other necessary changes needed by use of "RAMS" teams. These teams would then have only one learning curve on the modifications needed, rather than ~30 since the aircraft on the line would all be at different stages of production. There was even one airline (which I don't recall either, but it may have been UAL or someone in the South Pacific) that accepted their aircraft in the three person configuration, whether that configuration has since been changed or not I'm also not so sure. The extra flight station being removed from the original design may also explain the roominess of the 767 cockpit. It is by far the largest I have been in with more free space and comfort for the jumpseat passenger. Speaking only for myself. Hayes N. Press e-mail address: Hayes_Press@qmgate.larc.nasa.gov phone (804) 864-2715 fax (804) 864-7793 Good old Postal Service: Lockheed Engineering and Sciences Co. 144 Research Drive MS 156A Hampton, Virginia 23666