Newsgroups: sci.aeronautics.airliners Path: news From: hoyme@src.honeywell.com (Ken Hoyme) Subject: Re: Boeing 747-300 References: Message-ID: Approved: kls@ohare.Chicago.COM Organization: Honeywell Systems & Research Center, Mpls. MN, USA. X-Original-Message-Id: Sender: kls@ohare.Chicago.COM Date: Thu, 19 Nov 1992 15:35:39 GMT (I posted this yesterday, but our mailer had problems with finding where to send for this moderated newsgroup. I have been told this has been fixed. I see that other follow-ups have occured as well, but there is some information in here that wasn't covered. Rather than editing this, I am sending it on as originally written.) In article kls@ohare.Chicago.COM (Karl Swartz) writes: > In article jerry@telecom.ksu.edu (Jerry Anderson) writes: > Unless the Russians have something which I've missed, the 747-400 is > easily the largest commercial passenger aircraft in terms of number of > seats and payload. Its range is also the greatest of anything now in > service, though the Airbus A340 will exceed it once it enters service > next year. According to the "Commercial Airliners of the World" section of the 21-27 October 1992 issue of Flight International, the largest Russian transport is the Ilyushin II-86 Camber with a maximum seating of 350. I noticed that the max. seating estimates for the other airplanes were for sardine configurations, so I have to assume that this is not a 3-class estimate. (Ex: 747-400 with max seating of 660?? That's cramped!) >> McDonnell-Douglas MD-11 1993 >> Airbus AE-400 1994 >> Boeing 777 1995-6 > All three of these are much smaller than what you're thinking of. > Here are the important parameters for these three plus the 747-400 > for comparison. Seating is for a "typical" three-class cabin and > service is the date of first service; MGTOW is in US pounds. > Mfr. Type MGTOW seating service > Boeing 747-400 870,000 430 1989 > MacDAC MD-11 618,000 250 1991 > Airbus A-340 559,000 230 1993 > Boeing 777 515,000 ~220 1995 My data for the 777-200 is 3-class seating of 320, with a stretch version planned with 3-class seating in the 360-390 range. United ordered the 320 seat version according to AvWeek Oct. 22, 1990. According to AvWeek Nov. 4, 1991, the A-340-300 will have a 3-class seating configuration of 295, and the A340-200 will be shorter with 262 seats. > In the 600+ passenger market, Boeing has talked about both further > stretches of the 747 and an entirely new aircraft, sometimes using > the N650 moniker. McDonnell-Douglas has most recently talked about > the MD-12 -- once yet another stretch of the MD-11 -- as a new and > much larger aircraft, also in the 600+ passenger category. Airbus > has said that if there is demand and/or if Boeing builds such an > aircraft, Airbus will build one too. The name A600 or maybe A2000 > seems vaguely familiar though I can't locate any references. Boeing is considering three configurations for their "New Large Airplane (NLA)" A 747 stretch, a double deck 747 and a totally new double decker. 3 class seats range from 484-612. See AvWeek Jan 6, 1992 for a description of these options. An Oct. 28, 1991 AvWeek article covers Airbus's studies on large airplane configurations. That article confusingly talks about the ASX-700, but shows an artists concept with an A2000 on the tail. 600 3-class seats in a double deck configuration. I have also heard that Boeing will build theirs if Airbus launches. I suspect both are eying the market and hoping to delay the investment as long as possible, given the current economic climate. If one decides the go-ahead, the other will have to launch defensively to prevent the other from capturing the market. I hope this won't be another fiasco like the DC-10/L-1011 developments, where each captured enough of the market to keep the other from making any money. Lockheed got out of the business, and some have questioned whether MDAC has ever really recovered from that. Ken --- Ken Hoyme Honeywell Systems and Research Center (612)951-7354 3660 Technology Dr., Minneapolis, MN 55418 Internet: hoyme@src.honeywell.com