CBBS(R) 4.0.0c 02/14/89 22:46:33 You are caller 202719; next msg =41356; 478 active msgs. Prev. call 02/12/89 @ 22:07, next msg was 41342 LOG. 12 KILLED. 35 SUMMARY. 30 22:07:43,202640,2,WARD CHRISTENSEN,,16 02/12/89,22:23:51,202641,3,MURRAY ARNOW,, E#41342,25 02/12/89,23:29:41,202642,2,BEN LIBERMAN,,0 02/12/89,23:46:05,202643,2,PHIL JERN,,4 02/12/89,23:54:17,202644,2,JOEL WEINER,,2 02/13/89,03:55:05,202645,2,JERRY OLSEN,, E#41343,11 02/13/89,04:17:11,202646,2,JERRY OLSEN,, E#41344,5 02/13/89,06:02:14,202647,2,PETE JONES,,2 02/13/89,06:39:19,202648,1,BARRY POLLACK,,7 02/13/89,06:48:59,202649,1,BARRY POLLACK,,8 02/13/89,07:27:22,202650,1,JIM FLANAGAN,,2 02/13/89,08:18:51,202651,2,RICHARD HINTON,,4 02/13/89,08:30:37,202652,1,JOHN HABERMANN,,30 02/13/89,10:24:40,202653,2,BARRY BAYER,, 02/13/89,10:43:17,202654,2,XET MON,,3 02/13/89,10:51:49,202655,1,REBECCAH PRASTEIN,Chicago IL,37 02/13/89,11:24:26,202656,2,XET MON,, 02/13/89,11:31:34,202657,2,XET MON,,6 02/13/89,13:41:57,202658,1,STEVE JOHNSON,,4 02/13/89,13:52:14,202659,1,STEVE JOHNSON,,4 02/13/89,14:22:25,202660,1,ZURICH AMERICAN,Schaumburg/ IL,4 02/13/89,14:58:30,202661,1,REBECCAH PRASTEIN,,1 02/13/89,15:20:55,202662,2,JIM POLOUS,, E#41345,3 02/13/89,15:24:44,202663,1,DAVE DEVORE,,3 02/13/89,16:32:00,202664,2,JACK HOMA,,8 02/13/89,16:44:20,202665,1,BILL WOLFF,,1 02/13/89,17:02:16,202666,1,R MASKAY,chgo il, 02/13/89,17:59:28,202667,1,BILL MOST,Chicago,1 02/13/89,18:04:22,202668,1,COLIN SCHROEDER,,4 02/13/89,18:14:03,202669,1,JOHN COLEMNA,Chicago, 02/13/89,18:28:31,202670,1,BILL MOSTO,Chicago, E#41346,10 02/13/89,18:50:39,202671,1,RICHARD GOZDAL,, E#41347,10 02/13/89,19:02:33,202672,1,RICHARD GOZDAL,, E#41348,5 02/13/89,19:15:54,202673,1,BILL WOLFF,,3 02/13/89,19:27:26,202674,1,RON WILNER,BUFFALO GROVE IL,6 02/13/89,19:47:52,202675,1,JOHN HOSBEIN,NORTHBROOK/ IL,2 02/13/89,20:25:03,202676,1,KEN STOX,,5 02/13/89,21:15:13,202677,2,PHIL JERN,,0 02/13/89,21:26:14,202678,1,MICHAEL ZIMDAHL,,6 02/13/89,21:43:03,202679,3,MURRAY ARNOW,, E#41349,34 02/13/89,22:09:23,202680,1,BOB SULLIVAN,, E#41350,28 02/13/89,22:40:33,202681,1,SCOTT DREYER,Northlake/ IL,4 02/13/89,23:32:16,202682,7l!RANDON RICH,roselle,16 02/13/89,23:57:58,202683,2,BILL MATTSON,,5 02/14/89,00:06:25,202684,1,REBECCAH PRASTEIN,, E#41351,116 02/14/89,03:52:14,202685,1,FRANK PONIATOWSKI,,6 02/14/89,04:39:06,202686,2,ERIC BOHLMAN,,7 02/14/89,05:11:37,202687,2,TOM KOWALCZYK,,1 02/14/89,05:36:57,202688,2,PETE JONES,,1 02/14/89,06:47:16,202689,2,JACKIE PAYTON,, 02/14/89,06:59:01,202690,2,DENNIS STAHL,,5 02/14/89,08:17:46,202691,1,ALEX ZELL,,83 ]LaMonte (piggy on ucin and chinet) doesnt hang out here and "Rebeccah" doesnt know how to spell her name. Killed it and relayed to him anyway. ALEX ZELL, 02/14/89,08:39:05,202692,2,ALEX ZELL,,1 ]Come to think of it, it is an alternative spelling. Owell. Relayed to him anywa ALEX ZELL, 02/14/89,08:43:24,202693,2,GARY ELFRING,, E#41352,10 02/14/89,10:01:51,202694,2,PAM KNIGHT,, 02/14/89,10:34:49,202695,2,LARRY HITZ,,5 02/14/89,11:20:04,202696,1,MIKE KAVADIAS,,7 02/14/89,12:08:31,202697,3,PHIL SCHUMAN,,4 02/14/89,12:25:15,202698,1,PHIL JERN,,0 02/14/89,12:41:44,202699,2,STEVE CASTLE,,1 ]STEVE CASTLE, 02/14/89,13:13:29,202700,1,RICH MARQUARDT,SCHAUMBURG,23 ]I've been on your BBS over the years and you have really grown up .....all I can say is STAY ALIVE. You've given me a great amount of info thanks Rich Marquardt RICH MARQUARDT, 02/14/89,13:39:15,202701,1,RANDY IMAGEN,,14 02/14/89,13:56:13,202702,2,MARTY LINGG,,3 02/14/89,14:20:49,202703,2,PAUL ERICKSON,chicago/ il,3 02/14/89,17:01:31,202704,1,JOSEPH SKOM,,6 02/14/89,17:20:32,202705,1,BILL WOLFF,,3 02/14/89,18:02:48,202706,2,JAMES SCHMIDT,,1 02/14/89,18:40:19,202707,2,RICHARD HINTON,,0 02/14/89,19:10:23,202708,1,CEDRIC TUTTLE,, 02/14/89,19:27:39,202709,2,JIM POLOUS,,1 02/14/89,19:32:51,202710,1,JAY SANDHAUS,Phoenix/ AZ,6 02/14/89,21:16:35,202711,3,MURRAY ARNOW,,108 02/14/89,21:29:10,202712,1,ERIK BRUSKE,Chicago/ il, 02/14/89,21:49:32,202713,2,JIM MACK,CHICAGO/ IL,4 02/14/89,21:53:38,202714,1,MARTIN VALLEY,western springs/ il,10 02/14/89,22:09:30,202715,1,JASON COATH,, 02/14/89,22:27:46,202716,1,MICHAEL ZIMDAHL,,2 02/14/89,22:29:18,202717,1,RICHARD GOZDAL,, E#41353, E#41354,7 02/14/89,22:39:37,202718,1,KHALIL HAZZIEZ,, E#41355,6 02/14/89,22:46:37,202719,2,WARD CHRISTENSEN,, Msg 41342 is 03 line(s) on 02/12/89 from MURRAY ARNOW to RICHARD GOZDAL re: R/COPYRIGHT FORMS I wasn't aware there was a top & bottom margin requirement. The source listing I submitted didn't have very much space at the top and bottom. I guess it must have been sufficient. The copyright registration went through without hitches. Msg 41343 is 19 line(s) on 02/13/89 from JERRY OLSEN to MURRAY ARNOW ET AL. re: R/COPYRIGHT Within a fairly significant period of time (a year or years), you can always register a copyright even after your original copyright attains. The circumstances of an author help dictate the most prudent course, as well as the relative "commercialness" of a given work. The latter is fairly self evident. As for the former, many of us of course grind out stuff on a regular basis which, even though we want to retain control of it (partially so others at least legally can't bastardize it), experience dictates it just ain't commercially noteworthy. Unless and until it at least suggests it will be, it's money not well spent, at least in my view. I have the better part of a dozen programs written for use on a BBS I run, for example, which I don't expect will ever make me anyone else $, even though they're well written.In those cases, I've "reserved" the copyright for protection while giving out occasional copies -just in case.Note, BTW, that until a program is really , registering a copyright only expends the extra measure of protection to that which was submitted; future changes-often rather substantial-have no more protection than before registration. Now if someone's , gee, they could spend a few hundred $ over each year just protecting the changes (grin). Regards. Msg 41344 is 11 line(s) on 02/13/89 from JERRY OLSEN to ALL re: MORE COPYRIGHT Decided to get off my rear and walk across the room after logging off. Sec. 412 of the 1976 Act (paraphrased for brevity) indicates that an author may retain full rights in all respects if s/he registers the copyright (1) before an alleged infringement or (2) within 3 months of when it first was published, whichever is later. Legal difference between the two? If so registered, the author's remedies from the court are limited to (1) injunction and (2) actual damages. (Read the latter as the amount for which s/he was ripped off.) If formal registration is timely and proper, s/he also can petition for attorney's fees and statutory damages. (Read those as penalties.) Clearer now to us all, I trust. Msg 41345 is 01 line(s) on 02/13/89 from JIM POLOUS to CHARLIE KESTNER re: PERSTOR CONTROLLER I will be putting it in a WYSE 386. Msg 41346 is 06 line(s) on 02/13/89 from BILL MOSTO to ALL re: APPLE IIGS FOR SALE FOR SALE APPLE IIGS MOTHERBOARD WITH MOUSE KEYBOARD POWER SUPPLY LOTS OF GREAT SOFTWARE. 256k socketed on motherbboard, 1Mb on apples IIGS Memory Card. Great Price Great Hacker Machine Goodies include Ensoniq sound chip for music bufs as well as Great graphics. Price 799 or Best offer, Leave a message for me or call 281-0523 Msg 41347 is 16 line(s) on 02/13/89 from RICHARD GOZDAL to MURRAY ARNOW re: R/COPYRIGHT FORMS The Federal form disn't specify any margins but the file I read did. With all the messages on copyright, it looks like it is a subject needed to bring out the pros and cons on. The revisions don't always need to be resubmitted if I understand it correctly, just the major revisions. I would consider 1-2 years long enough to protect a new IDEA. If anyone wants it in that time they will either TAKE it or buy it. I won't even put the copyright notice on shareware anymore, haven't even received negative comments on any of it. If they want it in the compiled version they can have THAT. The two ideas I used were new and in an area no one writes small programs for. The copyright lets me sleep knowing that the two large companies that write astrology software won't take over the idea if sales become profitable enough for them to do so. It would be interesting to hear from ANYONE who had infringements and what the copyright or no copyright did for them. Msg 41348 is 13 line(s) on 02/13/89 from RICHARD GOZDAL to BILL WOLFF re: R/DISK MAILERS Got so wound up in the copyright stuff I forgot to mention2the disks and logged off, had to get on again. Got a price on the mailers. They will mail out samples of the sizes so I can check them out for my purposes. Qty of 500 for single (maybe 2 disks) is 22 cents plus shipping. Will probably order 500 of those. Can always sell extras at the computer group meetings. I am looking for a place that has pre-cut corrigated board 5 1/2 x 5 1/2 now. I can use that in the padded envelopes for the disks (4). That must be quite cheap if I get 1000 pieces, probably the smallest order possible unless I resort to having them cut somewhere. Heck, maybe I should sell mailers locally at the meetings. Make a few dollars WHILE there. Msg 41349 is 10 line(s) on 02/13/89 from MURRAY ARNOW to RICHARD GOZDAL re: R/COPYRIGHT FORMS It is true that minor revisions need not require a new registration. Major revisions(derivative works) should be registered. Derivative works are in a sense still protected by the original copyright. For instance, if the earlier work is copyrighted by someone else and you decide to author a derivative work you are violating the original copyright if you publish without permission. If the original author decides to challenge your work in court, your work has no independent value. I think its a big mistake to not show a copyright notice on shareware even if it has doubtful value. If your derivative work is to be copyrighted, you may be challenged by someone who stole your original ideas. You may then have one hell of a time establishing authorship. Msg 41350 is 12 line(s) on 02/13/89 from BOB SULLIVAN to BILL WOLFF re: R/VIRUS PROBLEM SOLVED? Years ago I used a PET and a C64. As I recall there is an interrupt vector that is updated about 60 times per second. I guess a program could somehow wedge itself into this part of the interpretation loop. Next it could check to see if it is on the current disk. If not then it could make a copy of itself (hidden of course) and then fill in the bit map to protect its location. Since the disk is really only a set of programs and not a booting DOS, insuring its re-entry into the RAM on the next boot is a problem. Possibly, it could tie itself to the DIRECTORY, a tie itself to a program, write over a program and use its name. My point is that wedging into the operating system is no problem on a Commodore; in fact, it is easier than on an Apple. Reassuring re-entry into the RAM is possible, too. ROMs may not be a panacea. Msg 41352 is 05 line(s) on 02/14/89 from GARY ELFRING to RICHARD GOZDAL re: MAILERS I use a larger mailer than you are probably looking for (6 1/2 x 9 1/2) h) however, my experience has been that Calumet Carton & Athropomorphic Sys. Systems seem to be competing with each other over price, even though Anthropomorphic systems buys their mailers from Calumet. My last quote for big mailers (in 1000s) was .23 from Anthro, and .26 from Calumet. Msg 41353 is 02 line(s) on 02/14/89 from RICHARD GOZDAL to MURRAY ARNOW re: R/COPYRIGHT FORMS Well, I guess i WILL put a copyright notice in all work no matter how bad or small it is. Msg 41354 is 09 line(s) on 02/14/89 from RICHARD GOZDAL to GARY ELFRING re: R/MAILERS I might use the larger mailer if it is needed to fit one disk and two sheets of paper in. Heck, the quote I got wasn't much more for a 500 qty. Whatever, these prices sure beat 65 cents each in retail stores! I got sucker into a large purchase (minimum order price) of cut corrigated board to put "around" the disks with docs in padded envelopes. Any one need a lot of 5 3/4 x 5 3/4 pieces of stock for mailing disks? hehe. Still cheaper than using mailers inside the envelopes (few cents each). Msg 41355 is 01 line(s) on 02/14/89 from KHALIL HAZZIEZ to TRACY LOSE re: RESPONSE TO R/PC WORK AT HOME Thanks tracy; I'm going to follow thru tonight!